Curse

Pandora's box · Oct 28, 2006, 05:27 PM // 17:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sid Soggybottom

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
And why do we need a dozen threads complaining about the AI popping up everyday now?

Well nobody forces you to read them!

Anyway, there was nothing wrong with the old AI. Its more the way the programmers make use of monster AI and map scripts lacks creativity:

-Instead of running away you can make a monster fade out when health becomes too low; meaning the last blow needs to be a huge one!
-Instead of x monster groups patrolling you can set 1 huge monstergroup on guard, spread over a large terrain. Once you attack the boss in the middle the others will hurry in...
-Put several neutral groups in the map, that is: neutral to the player. What the player does not know is that some groups are alligned 'friend' to players enemy, so when he attacks that enemy the allignment of some neutral groups change to enemy too...

and so on...

There are many ways to make a map more interesting. The question is why programmers always seem to stick to the same concepts: patrolling and some fading in (spiders). Because they can avoid changes to AI when they limit the amount of (farmerable) patrolling groups and use differend scripts.

lacasner · Oct 28, 2006, 05:30 PM // 17:30

Ok..its time to establish something here, with all of you people.

Wether you like it or not, you know that whenever ArenaNet changes something in this game it creates controvorsy. Now, this makes no sense. I mean, why would anyone get pissed off if the company that makes your game is expanding it? BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT!

This game is not being expanded. Frankly, I know that whenever an update happens, things are changed, not expanded. Now, you may think these statements are the same. But they are not. How about this Anet, instead of spending months and months making double waste time weekends why couldn't you have added quests or expanded on the landscape, added new weapons, or things like that? In other games companies do this, I don't know whats limiting you. And no, Nightfall does not count. Why? Because these are not NEW QUESTS. Yes, they may have different names, but you are doing the same thing again and again. Run here, kill this, its like a factions reversal all over again.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

There is a reason Anet are game developers and you are not. One of these reasons is because they know better how to create a game.

PvE is fine. PvP is excellent with some nice implementations like the new PvP chars.

The game is not a democracy. I assure you, for every complaint you make I can find someone that disagrees with you. Anet listens to the majority - and you are not in it.

The only one being arrogant is you for assuming the developers are here to make the game on your whims.

Do they really, you ignorant little complainer? You are about as contradictory as John Kerry, your third paragraph and fourth just contradicted each other.

To me, all of these people who are praising this game and revering it as "excellent" and "obsessivly fun", the "possibilites are endless" are LYING.Yes, I am calling you out right now. Why do you people like to argue for the sake of arguing?

I can verify this for people saying its fun to repeat missions over and over again with new characters. Why? With a comment like that, you have just labeled yourself as a liar for being obsessed with this game. Anet is lucky, for their little updates and redecorations of the same tree (reffering to Nightfall)
are just good enough to fool players like you Avarre. This game amazed me before. But now, I realize what it has become, and what it will continue to become.

Have a nice day people, I'm sorry if I came out a little angry but I am kind of distressed right now

The Pointless · Oct 28, 2006, 05:30 PM // 17:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pandora's box

Well nobody forces you to read them!

But these threads push the better threads past Page 2 very quickly, making respones to them feel like needless bumps

MSecorsky · Oct 28, 2006, 05:31 PM // 17:31

Yesterday, for gits and shiggles, I went to trap the low level grawls to see if they'd drop some dyes for me (they didn't...). Anyhoo... pull some into traps, they pop and die, but for this one grawl shaman or whatever. OK... no prob, his wand isn't doing all that much to me. So, I run over next to him and start dropping a trap. While I'm doing that, he turns and runs! Finding myself amused, I chase a bit... he stops and I get there and try to trap again. He runs again! A couple traps later I finally get behind him and chase him back the way we came from into the traps, which finally get him. Got 6 gold, I believe.

This was so hilarious that the obviously annoying aspect of the change was covered up. Changed to a barrager and ate them for lunch.

Yes, it's different, and yes, changes are required. In a month or two we won't even see posts about this anymore.

KESKI · Oct 28, 2006, 05:37 PM // 17:37

OK, I been on for 5 hours in last 2 days....
WHERE are these "INTELLIGENT ai" foes??
They dont even have the ability to "LEARN" how is that any where near intelligent??
Adept is the prove of intelligent, until monsters know how to change their tactic base on different classes with in players team, using landscape like players do, they are not intelligent. Bug brain ai is not intelligent.

Ok lets look at the farming..
Green drop solo farm- Not much change, its usualy build in a 1 on 1 case anyway, you can still do most of them.
Chest run- Well if you do it solo, there isnt any change, I heard the rare drop is random now, no more you get gold= I get gold, but havent yet to see it myself.(every one is doing NF>.>)
Money farm- where we solo a group of crazy bug brain and exchange most of the drop for gold. This looks like the farming style that been effect the most. Like the last aoe update, a lot of hit farming place dont work like they used to. But is money farm gone?? Of course not, unless you have a bug brain like the ai...just look for new type of foes, and use a different combo(in some case you dont even need a new combo). I had found nec, warrior, and monk, still working on my rt(which going to take some time...I want to start NF somepoint this weekend) This is not hard, take like 30 min of thinking and recalling the map and foes in there that I ever walk pass(you can use wiki too) a few times to refine your skill bar. There, its done, you are good for another few monthes. And if you are intelligent, keep it yourself, then your farming map and skill bar might live longer=P(griffen anyone?)

Alexi Jotun · Oct 28, 2006, 05:40 PM // 17:40

Yes, it has.

Criminally Sane · Oct 28, 2006, 05:40 PM // 17:40

What I see here are people who are willing to use their brains a little and people who aren't. The people who aren't don't embrace any changes to their game. They don't want to actually have to do something different, to adapt. Well, c'est la vie, mes amis. Life is full of changes. You adapt or die off. I'm fine if you who refuse to change all die off, it just means there'll be less people running 8 swordsmanship W/Mos in PvP and higher quality PUGs in PvE, for those who actually use PUGs.

With that said, I'm done here. There's nothing much to discuss really, either you like it or you don't, either you're adapting or you're just whining.

Franco · Oct 28, 2006, 05:48 PM // 17:48

You're lieing, Enemies dont flee from warriors, in fact I think Anet did something that enemies only attack warriors now.

Kern Wolf · Oct 28, 2006, 05:50 PM // 17:50

I'm strictly a PVE player. I've played my W/E since last October. This is my first (to date, only) MMORPG, and my favorite game overall. I own all three chapters, and the one thing I've come away as far as a philosophy to playing this game is:

Learn to adapt.

I didn't know too much about builds and skillsets when I first started playing Prophecies, but I learned how to go to forums, see what builds people were running, and how to tweak my own builds. I really didnt know too much about farming until I finished Factions; now I look over a majority of builds (tested and untested), experimenting with what works for me--and I'm having a LOT of fun in the process. I find this aspect of the game fun-- re-examinng those skills that I initially wrote off as "useless", only to come back, look at that "useless" skill again, and find a use for it. As such, my tactics change as a result--whether I was completing a mission for the umpteenth time, or farming in my favorite spots.

Now, I dont know if all the complaints I've been hearing or reading about is some type of "glitch" in the monster AI, or if it's an attempt to shake everyone into thinking about our builds differently, but I havent seen any threads about new builds to deal with Nightfall--just complaints. Is everyone just packing it in because we're being forced to alter our builds a bit? Where's all the creativity that was in Prophecies and Factions? We're not out of the 1st weekend yet folks, and I'm reading about, "Oh, this sucks", and "This game's ruined; so long!"

This is reminding me of the weekend when the "correction" was made to warrior's armor, and the shields were changed to "physical damage only" protection. And yeah, I was mad-- for about a day. But I was too into the game to not give some thoughts to how I could deal with the change. I did--and my gaming experience with Guild Wars went on.

IMHO, this is no different. Don't think of it as ANET trying to make the game for like PVP play--instead, give some thought as to how you can play your characters differently. You've all invested a lot of hours (not to mention money, especially if you bought all three chapters) to waste time being mad, especially since you're talking about only playing the game for 2-3 days.
The best analogy I can think of is Madden football. Any Madden player will tell you that Madden 2006 is NOTHING like Madden 2003, but they keep playing--and they love it too.

Learn to adjust and adapt, folks. IMHO, if you feel this way in about a month, then you have a legit reason for complaint....

lyra_song · Oct 28, 2006, 05:55 PM // 17:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by lacasner

Ok..its time to establish something here, with all of you people.

Wether you like it or not, you know that whenever ArenaNet changes something in this game it creates controvorsy. Now, this makes no sense. I mean, why would anyone get pissed off if the company that makes your game is expanding it? BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT!

Semantics issue aside....Anet is changing the game. I do think they are making it more complex with micromanaging with hero hench and waypoint controls, more customizable with the slew of new armor and weapon options.

These are the major changes that people really SHOULD be worried about.

The AI's idiocy is trivial compared to this.

Quote:

This game is not being expanded.

Maybe thats why they are called Chapters or Installments instead of expansions.

Hmn.....maybe? perhaps? mayhaps?

Quote:

Frankly, I know that whenever an update happens, things are changed, not expanded. Now, you may think these statements are the same. But they are not. How about this Anet, instead of spending months and months making double waste time weekends why couldn't you have added quests or expanded on the landscape, added new weapons, or things like that?

We have no proof as to the reasoning behind the double weekends.

My opinion, is that they are testbeds for changing drop settings, XP settings etc. Look at the double faction gain thats PERMANENT now.

Quote:

In other games companies do this, I don't know whats limiting you.

Lack of people i would imagine. Their Dev team is busy working on new chapters constantly, since this is their business model.

Their business model doesnt involve going back to older chapters and adding new stuff. Oh wait...Totem Axe...hmn...Icebreaker? No...they never go back and add new stuff.

http://guildwarsguru.com/forum/showt...php?t=10067724

Quote:

And no, Nightfall does not count. Why? Because these are not NEW QUESTS. Yes, they may have different names, but you are doing the same thing again and again. Run here, kill this, its like a factions reversal all over again.

And other MMORPGS are different?

"In order to become a ____, journey to the 4th level of this dungeon in the middle of nowhere and get me an item from some bad guy."

Quote:

Do they really, you ignorant little complainer? You are about as contradictory as John Kerry, your third paragraph and fourth just contradicted each other.

LOL. I love how you used Kerry in there. Contradiction is very different from someone misreading or misquoting you.

Quote:

To me, all of these people who are praising this game and revering it as "excellent" and "obsessivly fun", the "possibilites are endless" are LYING.Yes, I am calling you out right now. Why do you people like to argue for the sake of arguing?

I argue cause its fun. ^_^ <---loves debates.

I love this game. Its not perfect, theres goods and bads.

But the real reason i argue is because i see people who just cant see past the brickwall they rammed their heads into with frustration over one little thing and cant see the whole picture.

Quote:

Anet is lucky, for their little updates and redecorations of the same tree (reffering to Nightfall)
are just good enough to fool players like you Avarre. This game amazed me before. But now, I realize what it has become, and what it will continue to become.

I will point up

Quote:

Originally Posted by lyra_song

Anet is changing the game. I do think they are making it more complex with micromanaging with hero hench and waypoint controls, more customizable with the slew of new armor and weapon options.

I dont think these is a LITTLE update. Try rolling a PVP character and see how little these updates are.

Bastian · Oct 28, 2006, 06:19 PM // 18:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicken Ftw

I'm not even going to touch any parts of your statement but the wrong ones... oh wait, that's everything you've posted. <_<

Let me rephrase then, I'll only touch the part that refers to Guild Wars. 55 monks got a huge nerf with protective bond back in the day. Thousands of players cried about it. No change was made. Why? 'Cause no change needed to be made. Same thing applies now. Adapt a little - it's part of the Guild Wars universe. If you ever played a little PvP, you'd know how to adapt by now. Well, either that or you're still a scrub. Which, btw, you do sound like. Not willing to adapt? Play something else.

Don't see the relevance between A GAME and LIFE. You want to start a war because your precious build in a game doesn't work as well as it used to, have fun. Morons. >_>

Are we talking about 55 monks? No. We are talking about a much bigger change than one skill. We are talking about a change that has taken away content.

Adapt? Sure, I may - or I may quit. But what am I adapting for - so I can still do FedEx type quests and missions - all to realize that when I am done there is no real end-game content? Great! can't wait to play that game.

PvP... hmm, I do play r5, my old guild drifted between rank 400 and 1000 in GvG... I understand how to adapt, but I'm not like you who is going to kiss the ass of the butt that shits on me and the game i've spent a lot of time in (not to mention the fact that I spent money to purchase the games).

It doesn't matter whether it is a game or life - its still part of my life, and I have every right to complain as an unhappy customer. And guess what - in the end Anet is a business - and if they see that this is going to lose them business - they might listen.

I know, I know, you are going to say that we shouldn't have a say, or that they never listened in the past... guess what, I hope when ANet alienates all the poeple that love the game except you from all the changes they made - we can watch you in here crying when Anet files for bankruptcy and your character is left alone in a world where all he can do is solo - but the monsters keep running away.

Let us speak our mind without stepping in and telling us how we "have" to play the game. Or "adapt" to the game - as you like to say it. The game is weak - I'm leaving and I'm sure as more people do that is going to affect GW's quite a bit.

You gotta have money to keep the game going - and they are going to lose a lot of money.

Peace!

Daemon Loki · Oct 28, 2006, 06:24 PM // 18:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franco

You're lieing, Enemies dont flee from warriors, in fact I think Anet did something that enemies only attack warriors now.

I've noticed this too, say if I run in first with a dervish, and my hero warrior runs in next. After I take the first few hits they end up targetting him instead of me. I find the AI to be smarter then most games I have played in the past even ones that boast their AI is the best in ages, A-Net hasn't even said that and I would have to say they have done a pretty damn good job with the AI.

For those that are complaining about farming still, it imbalances the economy that is why they had to change things because later on down the road either everyone would end up rich or be forced to farm in order to pay for things and be rich themselves and this defeats the purpose of the game. A game is exactly what it is a way to have fun and play, farming was never part of the game or ment to be. This is an online game which requires things to stay at a balanced level so everyone can enjoy it, but that doesn't mean farming will ever be gone builds just need to change.

If the AI stayed the same way forever I'm sure more people would get bored of how easy they are to farm or kill or how stupid they react to skills and spells causing everyone to eventually quit the game. This game is about quests, enjoying the story, playing pvp and playing with others which is what an RPG is all about.

For those quitting, there will always be new players ones that will accept the AI for what it is now and will never really know what it was like before the giant "NERF".

LordLucifer · Oct 28, 2006, 06:28 PM // 18:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by w00t!

Cripple.

Adapt.

"addapt posts" are plain tupid -.-
anyway, agree with rose, if ppl enjoyed chasing mobs they would look for firestorm eles before this update...instead, if the ele had no decent AoEs the whole team would tell him to do nothing at all, an afk ele is more useful than a firestorm one...by far

Sid Soggybottom · Oct 28, 2006, 06:29 PM // 18:29

Ok some of you are just being willfully ignorant here. I can fully understand that some of you are having problems adapting to the new A.I. And yes, sometimes change is annoying.

But to you that are calling us LIARS?!! Just because you can't seem to adapt and others have is no reason to call people liars. You look pretty damn petty right now for doing so.

The way you're so quick in calling others liars about adapting just shows your own unwillingness to adapt and change.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LordLucifer

"addapt posts" are plain tupid -.-

Wow you're sure coherant and articulate. And nice argument about why "addapt posts are plain tupid"

Cottage Pie · Oct 28, 2006, 06:34 PM // 18:34

This new AI has KILLED the FoW.

it's like booktrick all over again, and i HATE it. am there right now, 5 man, but it's ok, i don't need to look, nobody's going to die, the tank has vig spirit and our bonder has LB, Barrier and Vital blessing stuck on him. every now and then i will cast dwayna's kiss.

This, clearly, is a bug.

LordLucifer · Oct 28, 2006, 06:34 PM // 18:34

yeh..that kinda ppl would say "adapt" even if they removed armors from GW

lacasner · Oct 28, 2006, 06:34 PM // 18:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bastian

Are we talking about 55 monks? No. We are talking about a much bigger change than one skill. We are talking about a change that has taken away content.

Adapt? Sure, I may - or I may quit. But what am I adapting for - so I can still do FedEx type quests and missions - all to realize that when I am done there is no real end-game content? Great! can't wait to play that game.

PvP... hmm, I do play r5, my old guild drifted between rank 400 and 1000 in GvG... I understand how to adapt, but I'm not like you who is going to kiss the ass of the butt that shits on me and the game i've spent a lot of time in (not to mention the fact that I spent money to purchase the games).

It doesn't matter whether it is a game or life - its still part of my life, and I have every right to complain as an unhappy customer. And guess what - in the end Anet is a business - and if they see that this is going to lose them business - they might listen.

I know, I know, you are going to say that we shouldn't have a say, or that they never listened in the past... guess what, I hope when ANet alienates all the poeple that love the game except you from all the changes they made - we can watch you in here crying when Anet files for bankruptcy and your character is left alone in a world where all he can do is solo - but the monsters keep running away.

Let us speak our mind without stepping in and telling us how we "have" to play the game. Or "adapt" to the game - as you like to say it. The game is weak - I'm leaving and I'm sure as more people do that is going to affect GW's quite a bit.

You gotta have money to keep the game going - and they are going to lose a lot of money.

Peace!

Finally, someone that sees through the same perspective as me. Listen to this man people, and stop being ignorant.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lyra_song

Maybe thats why they are called Chapters or Installments instead of expansions.

Hmn.....maybe? perhaps? mayhaps?

Lyra, that is the problem. This game is stagnant, and as far as I can see it will remain that way; Anet has no plans to stray from the path of least resistance. (Btw ya Kerry can pull the misrepresented card, just as his fellow loser Clinton but it cannot change the truth

)

Chicken Ftw · Oct 28, 2006, 06:35 PM // 18:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bastian

Are we talking about 55 monks? No. We are talking about a much bigger change than one skill. We are talking about a change that has taken away content.

PvP... hmm, I do play r5, my old guild drifted between rank 400 and 1000 in GvG... I understand how to adapt, but I'm not like you who is going to kiss the ass of the butt that shits on me and the game i've spent a lot of time in (not to mention the fact that I spent money to purchase the games).

How does mobs acting like people would and not rolling over and dying take away content?

Since when is r5 impressive, when there's r9 iway pugs? Guild rank 400? Took a PvE guild to rank 139 with 8 warriors once. None of these accomplishments prove that you know much of anything, much less how to adapt. How has ANet shit on you? They've improved the game imo. I've spent time in GW since July 2005, and I like these changes. I'm tired of being able to steamroll every mob in the game without any reaction from them. Apparently you liked it, so you're leaving. Well, have fun in your new, carebear-friendly game of choice.

lacasner · Oct 28, 2006, 06:37 PM // 18:37

Chicken no offense but imo did you select your username by finding which animal had the closest crainial capacity as you?

KESKI · Oct 28, 2006, 06:42 PM // 18:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bastian

Are we talking about 55 monks? No. We are talking about a much bigger change than one skill. We are talking about a change that has taken away content.

Adapt? Sure, I may - or I may quit. But what am I adapting for - so I can still do FedEx type quests and missions - all to realize that when I am done there is no real end-game content? Great! can't wait to play that game.

PvP... hmm, I do play r5, my old guild drifted between rank 400 and 1000 in GvG... I understand how to adapt, but I'm not like you who is going to kiss the ass of the butt that shits on me and the game i've spent a lot of time in (not to mention the fact that I spent money to purchase the games).

It doesn't matter whether it is a game or life - its still part of my life, and I have every right to complain as an unhappy customer. And guess what - in the end Anet is a business - and if they see that this is going to lose them business - they might listen.

I know, I know, you are going to say that we shouldn't have a say, or that they never listened in the past... guess what, I hope when ANet alienates all the poeple that love the game except you from all the changes they made - we can watch you in here crying when Anet files for bankruptcy and your character is left alone in a world where all he can do is solo - but the monsters keep running away.

Let us speak our mind without stepping in and telling us how we "have" to play the game. Or "adapt" to the game - as you like to say it. The game is weak - I'm leaving and I'm sure as more people do that is going to affect GW's quite a bit.

You gotta have money to keep the game going - and they are going to lose a lot of money.

Peace!

SPIT SPIRITE!! lol I can see you mean it when you say GW is part of your life.
The game is weak, I agree, I thought that is why A-net is toughen the monster up?? Not saying its good, bug brain isnt better ai, I am waiting for the update when monster will dance on my corp(or eat it)

Better yet, different ai for different type of monster!!